The Suspension Thread!!! BOOING

[RSL]

First 270 miles with the Mupo:

Paved backroads, some pretty rough a few dirt/rock Forest Service "roads" in the Ozarks.

1) The suspension is very balanced for the first time. Both the forks and the shock work together for a compliant, yet very connected, ride. Bad road sections don't affect the desired line in any way. I can still feel everything, it is that nothing upsets the bike now.

2) The rocky off-road section was considerably smoother with the slow speed compliance.

3) I will make a couple of shock compression setting adjustments to refine it for my preferences. So nice to be able to easily do this.

 

[zippy49]

That looks like a nice piece, but I ride two-up enough to want an easy way to adjust the preload. The hydraulic adjuster is a must. I note that there is one on the first pic you posted of the Mupo. Will this fit the Strada?

When I had the forks done at Racetech, the tech opined that the rear shock was not rebuildable. Did Roger just replace the spring, or did he make internal mods?

 

[RSL]

I don't know what Roger did with the rear shock. He still has it.

As for the preload adjuster, Mupo offers two different ones which are an easy addition.

I like this one best.

 

[PewPewLife]

I have a 2013 Hyperstrada. As the riding season comes to an end I'm starting to weight my options for upgrading the suspension and what will work best for me.

My first question though is how do I tell if I have a Hyper low or regular ride height Hyper? The only thing I can typically find is if I can flatfoot it then I have a low version which makes no sense considering everyone has different inseams.

What I'm considering now is Andreani fork cartridges and revalving and respringing the rear for my weight. I think that will be enough for my riding style without breaking the bank.

 

[RSL]

The VIN and a call to a dealer will reveal which version you have.

 

[BadToTheBown]

My Mupo has arrived...

 

[touficzeidan]

Mine arrived last week and had lemick racing in Rancho Cucamonga install them.

1st impression: wow, no more brake diving, no more going on bumps and feeling like the bike is gonna fall apart.

Overall a much better ride. I spent some time riding through the canyons and slowly adjusting the front setup. I am still not sure how to adjust the rear shock yet, I left it with mupo recommendation.

Overall I spent $2100 but I feel it's worth it as I am planning on keeping the bike for the long run.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[BadToTheBown]

Looks like you took the same round on yours, except for the coatings I got carried away with...

 

[touficzeidan]

Looks like you took the same round on yours, except for the coatings I got carried away with...

Where did you get yours done? Have you tried them yet?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[RSL]

The two things that add riding performance better than all are:

1) Suspension - Properly adjusted to your weight and riding too.

2) Rider Training - Smooth, calm and precise.

You can have all the power in the world, but if your tires don't stay connected to the ground, or if you choose the wrong line, or make mid-turn corrections, you will fall well behind the old rider on the old under-powered bike, usually two-up.

 

[touficzeidan]

The two things that add riding performance better than all are:



1) Suspension - Properly adjusted to your weight and riding too.



2) Rider Training - Smooth, calm and precise.



You can have all the power in the world, but if your tires don't stay connected to the ground, or if you choose the wrong line, or make mid-turn corrections, you will fall well behind the old rider on the old under-powered bike, usually two-up.

Is the goal of suspension setup to attain a perfect balance between the front and rear shock?

I am waiting for pro Italia (Ducati shop in Los Angeles) to host Dave moss suspension clinic and seminar in May to better understand how to tune.
If you have any good sources please send my way

Thanks


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[RSL]

Balance is important, as anyone driving a pickup can tell you about how the front and rear suspension fight each other.

However, every bit as important is how the suspension reacts to road imperfections by absorbing bumps and pushing into depressions. The goal being keeping the best tire contact with the road surface.

High speed reaction.

Low speed reaction.

The ability to perform hour after hour without failure, which means heat dissipation.

The ability to take the big hits without failure.

In order to accomplish this, it is better to size the springs to correctly carry the weight of the rider. Most Americans are heavier than the bantam weight bikes are designed for.

The art in getting suspension right is to hit that middle ground around the rider and the riding they do. This is because there is no One Size Fits All suspension sizing or settings.

BMW does a good job of masking the road surface with the Telelever and Duolever front suspension. With this design, the performance of the shock isn't noticed as much, though when the road is really bad.....

 

[BadToTheBown]

Where did you get yours done? Have you tried them yet?

Same place RSL did, Roger Albert at OffRoad/OnRoad in Austin TX.

I have a couple of hours on them and need to adjust some. Sprung for my weight now, can feel so much without bottoming now. Harder I ride them, better they feel. Feels like it needs to be adjusted for small bumps but haven't yet had time to play with it.

 

[BadToTheBown]

Balance is important, as anyone driving a pickup can tell you about how the front and rear suspension fight each other.

However, every bit as important is how the suspension reacts to road imperfections by absorbing bumps and pushing into depressions. The goal being keeping the best tire contact with the road surface.

High speed reaction.

Low speed reaction.

The ability to perform hour after hour without failure, which means heat dissipation.

The ability to take the big hits without failure.

In order to accomplish this, it is better to size the springs to correctly carry the weight of the rider. Most Americans are heavier than the bantam weight bikes are designed for.

The art in getting suspension right is to hit that middle ground around the rider and the riding they do. This is because there is no One Size Fits All suspension sizing or settings.

BMW does a good job of masking the road surface with the Telelever and Duolever front suspension. With this design, the performance of the shock isn't noticed as much, though when the road is really bad.....

+1 Also agree with observation on BMW Telelever, which is where most of my experience is with. You need to trust these front ends more than you will feel them.

 

[RSL]

I wonder why we haven't seen magnetic controlled shocks on motorcycles yet. That is where you can have cheap shocks that are filled with iron particles in the fluid, which are restricted to a nearly infinite degree with electric current applied to a restriction point.

Maybe too much computer control?

Maybe too expensive for limited sales?

 

[kuksul08]

Question for those who have upgraded or changed the suspension - can you please list your weight and the spring rate used in your setup both front and rear? And perhaps preload if you have that too?

I've been playing around a bit with my bike, talking to a couple suspension gurus, took some high-speed video, comparing the numbers to other bikes. Trying to figure out a more plush suspension setup. The SP is set up for the track, and thus is very stiffly sprung for minimal chassis movement. It's A+ on smooth back roads, but leaves a lot to be desired on rough roads. I generally use about 1/2 of the total travel after a ride.

I already changed the rear spring to something slightly softer... 100N/mm versus 110N/mm. Really helped, but I think I could still go lighter. I'm thinking about 90N/mm in the rear and .6 to .65kg/mm fork springs. But that's just a guess right now. The goal being to make it more "motard" and less "racebike".

 

[BadToTheBown]

I wonder why we haven't seen magnetic controlled shocks on motorcycles yet. That is where you can have cheap shocks that are filled with iron particles in the fluid, which are restricted to a nearly infinite degree with electric current applied to a restriction point.

Used these for support and isolation on the Space Shuttle. If using permanent magnets (we had), you should expect to keep a good distance between your electronics and those magnets (very strong fields). Wonder what that means for the bike electronics?

OK, permeable material in a fluid? Been done and works. Not cheap. What if you dumb it down with something like iron? Expect it to erode your valving, bushings, etc.

 

[RSL]

LINK: https://www.autoevolution.com/news/how-magnetorheological-suspension-works-8947.html

"Magnetorheological fluid is a composite of ferritic nano-dipoles suspended in a carrier fluid, which align themselves along lines of applied magnetic flux to vary the yield stress of the whole."

In other words: Iron filings mixed with 10W oil.

Introduced for the first time in 2002, on GM's Cadillac Seville STS, the so called magnetorheological suspension system is slowly but surely catching on. Although it has been made available on several vehicles, including Buick and Chevrolet, the system has been made famous by German manufacturer Audi, with its introduction on the TT and R8.

What sets it apart from other suspension systems is the fact that it lacks any electro-mechanical valves and it basically has no small moving parts. Instead, the suspension is based on a magnetorheological fluid (MR), a type of smart fluid, as it is called, which reacts to a magnetic field.

MR is in fact a carrier fluid, usually oil, which is filled with micrometer-sized magnetic particles. When subjected to a magnetic field, the magnetic particles inside increase the fluid's viscosity, rendering it viscoelastic solid. Usually, a MR suspension system is made of four magnetorheological struts or shock absorbers, a sensor set and an electronic control unit (ECU).

 

[BadToTheBown]

...[ferrite] nano-dipoles ...In other words: Iron filings mixed with 10W oil.

Not to be a prick but I stand by what I said, expensive. It does work but look at the price tag on the cars using this. I also stand by my point on erosion.

You do offer a good simplified analogy in your bold description. I think it is basically true but so is what I said. If I took your "iron fillings" literal (I don't), I think my "erosion" statement stands. However, erosion isn't a problem with nano particles (100 nanometers or less). These are pretty small relative to "metal fillings" which makes a pretty huge difference (no pun intended) in their ability to erode. Liquid porting of cylinder heads is probably a good example where it takes larger particles to erode the metal.

I do understand your analogy to "iron" and iron is a constituent but it's really a metal oxide. Although I'm not sure of this compound mix/recipe, they are typically permeable metals like nickel, iron, copper, etc.

Don't get me wrong, technically it's good stuff but affordability is a ways off, if ever and putting iron fillings in 10W oil will not last.

 

[RSL]

When I think of the latest generation of motion sensors offered by Bosch to motorcycle manufacturers, I think active suspension is very near for motorcycles. We all thought semi-active suspension was but a dream not so many years ago as well. Expensive and unreliable. Now it is common and part of a value priced package.

Now that we are seeing auto electronics making the transition to motorcycles as never before, it is only time.

The useful life of any shock is far less than the vehicle. Even the venerable Ohlins calls for relatively frequent rebuilding.

No, I would be an early adopter of active suspension.