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Throttle problem/Surging

To recap.
You bought a state of the art machine with a sophisticated ECU. You then added a 1980s ham fisted adjuster to it. And you wonder why it works worse now?
Maybe take the PC off and let it run properly.
If it doesn't have enough HP. Buy a bike that does?
Just a suggestion.


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astrocortex said:
i don't mind spending money, i just want the damn thing to run properly! Isn't there a Ducati race ecu that would eliminate all this as well?
Click to expand...

No, there is an "up-map" that goes along with the termi exhaust is all.

RedSquare said:
To recap.
You bought a state of the art machine with a sophisticated ECU. You then added a 1980s ham fisted adjuster to it. And you wonder why it works worse now?
Maybe take the PC off and let it run properly.
If it doesn't have enough HP. Buy a bike that does?
Just a suggestion.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Click to expand...

Lol you're joking right? The factory tune is designed to pass emissions tests. It doesn't have performance or rideability in mind. Maybe the Japanese models get a different tune, but the bikes here are pretty terrible. Hard to ride smoothly.
 
kuksul08 said:
No, there is an "up-map" that goes along with the termi exhaust is all.



Lol you're joking right? The factory tune is designed to pass emissions tests. It doesn't have performance or rideability in mind. Maybe the Japanese models get a different tune, but the bikes here are pretty terrible. Hard to ride smoothly.
Click to expand...

It seems some are and some aren't

The regs in Europe are stringent too - it's hard to believe that the 821 wasn't designed from the ground up to deal with this.

Mine is fine - it has a lot of engine braking but that's throttle plate design not fueling. At about 6k miles it seemed to loosen up nicely.
 
appliance821 said:
It seems some are and some aren't

The regs in Europe are stringent too - it's hard to believe that the 821 wasn't designed from the ground up to deal with this.

Mine is fine - it has a lot of engine braking but that's throttle plate design not fueling. At about 6k miles it seemed to loosen up nicely.
Click to expand...

Good point. I wonder why there is so much variability.

Anywho, at least we have some options.
 
kuksul08 said:
Good point. I wonder why there is so much variability.

Anywho, at least we have some options.
Click to expand...

You know the answer to that, Italian engineering. If my back would ever let up I'd get out there and get it going properly.

I spoke with dyno jet and the local Dyno guy and they gave me a few suggestions to try.

First one is to 0 out the map and see how it goes. It's like almost bypassing the PC. It's still entirely possible, but unlikely, that I broke something after the install. This method would expose whether that's the case.

Both were pretty confident that when I looked at it on the computer while it's running, that I would see the throttle position hopping around when it should be at 0. Apparently that is fairly common with Ducati. Trouble is, to reset it, dynos instructions call for a fly by wire throttle to be on the Dyno and under load.

If worse comes to worse and the throttle sensor looks perfect and the bike isn't just broken, I have to remove the tank and put it back on properly anyway, so disconnecting the power commander will be pretty simple.

But then I'm back to square one. Next step from there will be changing out a sprocket to put me at the right rev range for local speeds. That doesn't solve the problem so much as move it to another speed that I ride at less frequently.
 
Last edited:
RedSquare said:
To recap.
You bought a state of the art machine with a sophisticated ECU. You then added a 1980s ham fisted adjuster to it. And you wonder why it works worse now?
Maybe take the PC off and let it run properly.
If it doesn't have enough HP. Buy a bike that does?
Just a suggestion.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Click to expand...

None of that makes any sense.
 
You should read my thread about my RB Evo install. I pinched my main fuel line and thought it was a fault in the unit. In my case, the bike completely choked out above 6K rpm or above about 1/3 throttle.

You said you had a lot of trouble with the fuel pump cover, which is a *****. You could have kinked the fuel line just enough that your disrupting the flow and causing reading/sending error.

You have to go way more sophisticated than a PC with a closed loop system. Had the same problem with my Acura TL years ago.
 
So, I posted a few pages back about the surging issues I was having on a new 939 strada. I don't live near an authorized dealership and I had the 600 mile service interval done by a guy who was a Ducati certified tech in a former life but didn't have the DDS system. It wasn't until just now and mile 1500, after nearly ordering a kit to flash the ECU in frustration, that I finally brought it down to a dealership to have the service light turned off. They checked for mapping updates and found one had been released for the injection control unit.

It is night and day. It's still Italian engineering and will have some jerkiness, but the issue is 90% gone and the thing is a joy to ride at low RPMs.

I have no idea how recent this update is or if it applies to the 821s, but the moral of the story is to visit a guy with a DDS and have him run your VIN for updates.
 
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rhyrea said:
So, I posted a few pages back about the surging issues I was having on a new 939 strada. I don't live near an authorized dealership and I had the 600 mile service interval done by a guy who was a Ducati certified tech in a former life but didn't have the DDS system. It wasn't until mile 1500 and nearly ordering a kit to flash the ECU in frustration that I finally brought it down to a dealership to have the service light turned off. They checked for mapping updates and found one had been released for the injection control unit.

It is night and day. It's still a V twin and will have some jerkiness, but the issue is 90% gone and the thing is a joy to ride at low RPMs.

I have no idea how recent this update is or if it applies to the 821s, but the moral of the story is to visit a guy with a DDS and have him run your VIN for updates.
Click to expand...

that happened every time I took my bike to the dealer. "We installed a new update your bike should run great now". It ran great for 20 miles and was back to its normal self. I believe it's because they cleared the O2 adaptations.
 
gatdammit said:
You should read my thread about my RB Evo install. I pinched my main fuel line and thought it was a fault in the unit. In my case, the bike completely choked out above 6K rpm or above about 1/3 throttle.

You said you had a lot of trouble with the fuel pump cover, which is a *****. You could have kinked the fuel line just enough that your disrupting the flow and causing reading/sending error.

You have to go way more sophisticated than a PC with a closed loop system. Had the same problem with my Acura TL years ago.
Click to expand...

I think you're on too something. You remember how the fuel line fit in that channel and then clipped in right before going to the pump? Not only is mine not in the channel,or clips, but it's going under that cross bar rather than over it. When my friend cranked down the cover we very well may have pinched it.

Did you have to replace the fuel line?
 
kuksul08 said:
that happened every time I took my bike to the dealer. "We installed a new update your bike should run great now". It ran great for 20 miles and was back to its normal self. I believe it's because they cleared the O2 adaptations.
Click to expand...

Yeah, was mostly back to normal after 100 miles or so. It's pretty infuriating - they tantalize you with how amazing it could be without emission controls and then take it away.

The ECU update wasn't just cosmetic though. Before, sport was the most jerky of the modes whereas now oddly enough it's the most smooth, which seems to jive with some of the impressions from earlier in the thread.
 
So if I want to remove the power commander, do I simply unscrew the wire splice they gave us, remove the grey wire and screw the splice back together? And remove all the other stuff, obviously. It's the electrical connection I'm concerned with.

Fuel line comes tomorrow so I am going to revert everything back to pre PC and see how it goes. Gonna leave the assembly zip tied in just in case, just disconnect it all and cross my fingers.
 
I think gatdammit got his from italy directly as well.

I paid full price thru the website. The guy supports the product as well as he can, but there's not much to go wrong with it.
 
kuksul08 said:
I think gatdammit got his from italy directly as well.

I paid full price thru the website. The guy supports the product as well as he can, but there's not much to go wrong with it.
Click to expand...



Do you recommend the product? Is it worth it in your opinion?


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When I bought mine, I was able to get a UPC or serial # from the listing and sent it to Dimsport, makers of the RB units. They said it was a legit model and not refurbished. What you don't get by saving $150 is service support, though I actually got that too from a vendor in Orlando. You need to read my thread about what I thought was wrong with mine and what it turned out to be (kinked main fuel line). Pulling the tank is a *****...no two ways about it. I think my DIY was pretty thorough, with pics.
 
gatdammit said:
When I bought mine, I was able to get a UPC or serial # from the listing and sent it to Dimsport, makers of the RB units. They said it was a legit model and not refurbished. What you don't get by saving $150 is service support, though I actually got that too from a vendor in Orlando. You need to read my thread about what I thought was wrong with mine and what it turned out to be (kinked main fuel line). Pulling the tank is a *****...no two ways about it. I think my DIY was pretty thorough, with pics.
Click to expand...



Link please [emoji4]

I think I'll take the dive and get it from Italy and handle the rest my self.
Thanks


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