The Suspension Thread!!! BOOING

[gatdammit]

That's a good price for a high-end rear shock. Looks like you can't get the Plus model with dual reservoir so comparable to the Ohlins I got. You can get Andreani front inserts a lot cheaper and they work great for street use. Be sure they can set for your anthro's before placing order. Rear installation isn't a very hard job if you have a center stand. R&R'ing the rear hugger was the most painful part for me...friggin thing.

 

[krolinked]

Does anybody happen to have handy the oil quantity in cc for the 2014 Hypermotard SP? the black Marzochi forks. I am replacing seals but havent got access to the numbers because my file isnt working for the computer. Thanks in advance! Left and right legs if theyre different

 

[nickwst4]

OK, I feel it's time to improve the suspension on my '13 821 HS to make it more compliant over real-world surfaces, rather than just trunk roads. Being in the UK, I've spoken to Brook Suspension, who recommend the Andreani cartridges as good value. I also asked about YSS fully-adjustable shocks, but the guy said I'd do better to avoid the Thailand-made one-size-fits-all YSS and instead go for Nitron R2, which are fully tailored for the rider and even cost slightly less than YSS at £721. Having said that, he suggested I might consider Nitron's new fork cartridges to match, which are of course fully-adjustable and have an extra high-speed damping valve for harsh hits. Sounds like a no-brainer to go for matching UK-made Nitrons, the only catch being their cartridges are about twice the price of the Andreanis at £1K!

Has anyone any comments? And should I just go Nitron cos it's only money and I love the bike and have sorted most all of the rest of its failings?

Thanks,

Nick, Norfolk UK

 

[uncle brad]

OK, I feel it's time to improve the suspension on my '13 821 HS to make it more compliant over real-world surfaces, rather than just trunk roads. Being in the UK, I've spoken to Brook Suspension, who recommend the Andreani cartridges as good value. I also asked about YSS fully-adjustable shocks, but the guy said I'd do better to avoid the Thailand-made one-size-fits-all YSS and instead go for Nitron R2, which are fully tailored for the rider and even cost slightly less than YSS at £721. Having said that, he suggested I might consider Nitron's new fork cartridges to match, which are of course fully-adjustable and have an extra high-speed damping valve for harsh hits. Sounds like a no-brainer to go for matching UK-made Nitrons, the only catch being their cartridges are about twice the price of the Andreanis at £1K!

Has anyone any comments? And should I just go Nitron cos it's only money and I love the bike and have sorted most all of the rest of its failings?

Thanks,

Nick, Norfolk UK

Did you see this?

Shocking - Nitron Carts and Shock

Recently had my local shop install new carts and shock from Nitron. 2016 939 Hyperstrada. Nitron Shocks Shock is NTR R3. Spring and oil weight is bespoke assembly from factory. Sag was set at the shop for my 84kgs in-gear weight. Rear shock was great from the Nitron factory with the clickers...

hyperstrada.com

 

[nickwst4]

O-oh, didn't remember that thread, so thanks Uncle B!

I ought to have done because I chipped in and bad-mouthed Nitron's shock specced for my 650 Cagiva Raptor. Glad to say that Nitron re-valved that one for me gratis. Still not a brilliant ride on that bike but better, and the Nitron people were very willing to help.

From what I see, the R3 Nitron shock is a bit overkill for me, as the R2, which they recommended for the HS, has separate compression and rebound damping already.

 

[nickwst4]

Regarding comments above about the ride height of a Nitron-equipped HS, it's worth noting that there is some length adjustment available on all the Nitron monoshocks. It may not be much at the shock, but I guess that's multiplied at the wheel. If the cartridges raised the front, presumably the fork tubes can be dropped through the clamps?

 

[appliance821]

Had a full nitron set up done, front and rear -very very nice.

 

[nickwst4]

Had a full nitron set up done, front and rear -very very nice.

Ok, thanks for that. I expect you went for the R3 shock with extra compression damping control? Considering the cost of the cartridges, the extra for that over the R2 isn't much.

 

[appliance821]

Ok, thanks for that. I expect you went for the R3 shock with extra compression damping control? Considering the cost of the cartridges, the extra for that over the R2 isn't much.

I think it is an R2 with a remote preload adjuster and compression adjustment. I'll have to double check. It hasn't needed any adjustment so I haven't looked too closely. I don't do track so I didn't need the full monte.

 

[nickwst4]

App821,
I'd appreciate knowing which Nitron shock you have. Like you, I have no interest in doing track days but I'd guess most tracks are a lot smoother than our roads and it seems to me that control of high-speed compression comes into its own on poor roads. The Nitron fork cartridges apparently have extra valving for high speed deflections, so it makes sense to have that on the shock too, surely? The suspension guy I spoke to at Brook suggested that the only problem with the extra adjustment on the R3 is that rider/owners get into a muddle when they rwiddle with them! Would we be that silly?

 

[appliance821]

App821,
I'd appreciate knowing which Nitron shock you have. Like you, I have no interest in doing track days but I'd guess most tracks are a lot smoother than our roads and it seems to me that control of high-speed compression comes into its own on poor roads. The Nitron fork cartridges apparently have extra valving for high speed deflections, so it makes sense to have that on the shock too, surely? The suspension guy I spoke to at Brook suggested that the only problem with the extra adjustment on the R3 is that rider/owners get into a muddle when they rwiddle with them! Would we be that silly?

I'll be back with the bike in a couple of days and give you the model number. I think your suspension guy is wise, that's why I told my guy to keep possibe adjustments in the rear to the minimum - LOL. The way I see it, is that a good shock, with the right spring rate, has high and low built in at a certain proportion, and the adjuster dials it in and out while maintaining that proportion. I'm riding rural roads, and some can be quick and rough, and others dirt, and the Nitron has been fine. Apart from small changes to rebound and compression up front, I'm letting sleeping dogs lay for now. Knowing myself, I think it is a good idea. Oh yes... But you may ride harder, faster - anyway, I'll get the model number soon.

 

[ericrobinson]

App821,
I'd appreciate knowing which Nitron shock you have. Like you, I have no interest in doing track days but I'd guess most tracks are a lot smoother than our roads and it seems to me that control of high-speed compression comes into its own on poor roads. The Nitron fork cartridges apparently have extra valving for high speed deflections, so it makes sense to have that on the shock too, surely? The suspension guy I spoke to at Brook suggested that the only problem with the extra adjustment on the R3 is that rider/owners get into a muddle when they rwiddle with them! Would we be that silly?

I went with the R3 as a "just in case". Keeping the economy afloat with my overspending! And the remote preload which is very handy.

The higher setup is fine for me with a 34" inseam.

 

[appliance821]

Ok, thanks for that. I expect you went for the R3 shock with extra compression damping control? Considering the cost of the cartridges, the extra for that over the R2 isn't much.

Just wanted to confirm that it is the N2. I guess I should have known right away, but the parts numbers etc, aren't entirely clear. I've focused on the front to get it where I want asthe rear has seemed just fine. Most of my riding is back roads - some nice and rough - between 60 - 80 mph. The thing is like glue.

I might play with preload because I put on scorpion rally STRs and they slow the steering a little bit. Might do a mall preload adjust to see is that changes things. More curiousity than anything.

 

[appliance821]

Made some final tweaks to the suspension - full nitron with the N2 shock - and it is so sweet. The clickers on the forks really allow precise calibration. Banged down my favorite local road - twists and elevation changes and craptastic deteriorating surface. The bike was firm and responsive, no jarring, no pitching, and held a line like glue.

 

[nickwst4]

That is very good news, as I've got the full Nitron kit waiting to be fitted by my Ducati guru later this year. I sprung for the R3 shock because the difference in price was not big, considering the total cost. What did niggle was that the expensive Niton fork oil is no longer included in the cost of the cartridges, contrary to Nitron's website. Since their triple-valve technology must be calibrated to their own oil, it seems to be a must. I know just the road I'll test the bike on cos my beloved Cagiva Gran Canyon, despite it's long-travel suspension and plush seat, was very uncomfortable yesterday!

 

[1-3-2-4]

Recently did the swap on my 2016 low model. Went with a set of Andreani cartridges up front (165 mm stroke) and an Andreani-spec Ohlins shock out back. Shock is a shortened version of the SP OEM shock with revised valving.

I’m about 205 lbs in gear and have a top case always on the bike. First cut was 0.83 kg/mm fork spring and a 95 N/mm shock spring.

I ended up specifying the front spring rate since both Andreani and FBI wanted to see me on either a 0.90 or 0.95. Ended up with 50 mm rider sag up front without any additional preload (my goal was 55 mm). Ride quality up front is superb even with the standard damping settings. I’m debating the next fork spring rate down but it feels really good as is. Much better than the short travel 0.63 kg/mm garbage I pulled out of there!

I used Andreani spring rate recommendation on the rear, but sag came in initially at 59 mm! Was able to get it down to 50, but it was with a TON of preload and I couldn’t add any more. Bike steers a little slower than desired and some of the frost heaves hit the rear much more than the front. Leaning toward increasing the spring rate in the rear so as to run less preload for better ride quality and luggage capacity.

All things considered the bike is night and day different. Firm and supple with travel for days (compared to stock). Looking at the cartridges, I believe I can safely and easily add 10-15 mm more down travel without having to lengthen the now tall suspension even more. So I plan to look at that this winter. And maybe try a lower rate to get the sag and attitude I’m looking for.

 

[uncle brad]

I'm curious as to which part number you went with for the Andreanni carts? I used the low version set for my 2016.

 

[1-3-2-4]

I'm curious as to which part number you went with for the Andreanni carts? I used the low version set for my 2016.

105/D09E. I’d imagine your kit is a shortened version. The Andreani cartridges are modular in their design.

We do a lot of suspension work here and this is my first time using Andreani. From an engineering perspective, I’m very impressed with how clever they were to incorporate modularity and producibility into their design. For an open chamber design, there is no reason to spend almost twice as much on Ohlins, Traxxion, K-tech, Nitron, et al. This was a personal project on my own bike to gauge if we should begin offering them - and we will.

 

[gatdammit]

I did the 105/D09E Andreani drop in's when they were about the only option back in 2016. Got a decent open box discounted set on eBay. Ran those with stock standard height rear shock until around 2020, when I got the time and $$$ to install a fantastic Ohlins TTX - fully adjustable but does not have multi-speed valving. I ordered it in Italy when I lived there and it was set for anthro's and typical bike config/ load. The Andreani's were a great upgrade but my bike was a daily driver and always ran full bags and a heavy rescue kit in a 3rd bag on the rear seat. This setup is great for hooning the bike naked but also gave me the ability to stiffen the rear enough for loaded config, while retaining comfort and performance. The rear TTX did raise ride height about 1/2".

I'm still chasing the perfect settings, but I got it pretty comfy on long slab and I can lean it to the bitter edge of my Road 6's. They can get a bit harsh and pogo on bad pavement - let me know how you would adjust that out. The rebound keeps up with the compression but I would like it a bit softer overall.

There's lot's of good full kit options out there these days and we've beaten it up pretty good. I honestly wouldn't go with a full custom setup for my current use but if I turn it into a track bike someday, certainly would.

 

[uncle brad]

I did the 105/D09E Andreani drop in's when they were about the only option back in 2016. Got a decent open box discounted set on eBay. Ran those with stock standard height rear shock until around 2020, when I got the time and $$$ to install a fantastic Ohlins TTX - fully adjustable but does not have multi-speed valving. I ordered it in Italy when I lived there and it was set for anthro's and typical bike config/ load. The Andreani's were a great upgrade but my bike was a daily driver and always ran full bags and a heavy rescue kit in a 3rd bag on the rear seat. This setup is great for hooning the bike naked but also gave me the ability to stiffen the rear enough for loaded config, while retaining comfort and performance. The rear TTX did raise ride height about 1/2".

I'm still chasing the perfect settings, but I got it pretty comfy on long slab and I can lean it to the bitter edge of my Road 6's. They can get a bit harsh and pogo on bad pavement - let me know how you would adjust that out. The rebound keeps up with the compression but I would like it a bit softer overall.

There's lot's of good full kit options out there these days and we've beaten it up pretty good. I honestly wouldn't go with a full custom setup for my current use but if I turn it into a track bike someday, certainly would.

Any idea what your spring rate is in the front?